There may not be any way to stop Trump, but there is an honorable and necessary way to try. It's time for the voices of sanity to speak in an organized way, rather than in the odd interview or off the record comments here or there. Mattis, Kelly, Millie, Cohen, Barr, Esper, Rosen, Romney, Flake, Cheney, Corker, etc, need to join forces and say what they've seen and know about Trump and the dangers he presents. They should join forces with the Lincoln Project or form their own group. There is plenty of money to support a loud and proud media campaign. It's possible such a broad and credentialed group could shake the non-MAGA crowd out of their slumber. We and they need to stop acting as if this is a normal campaign cycle. These folks speaking up may not work, but they owe it to the Country to try.
You are buying the idea that these mega-wealthy Republicans really want to stop Trump. Sorry to say it this way, but don't be naive -- they have supported the radicalization of the Republican party every step of the way for the last sixty years. The notion that they want to stop now that they are close to achieving their objective of establishing a fascist dictatorship here begs credulity.
No sir, I am buying the idea that the types of people I identified are sane and truly want to stop Trump. The money can be found from various corners left, right, and center. You call me naive; I say in response you are painting with a broad and imprecise brush , buying cartoonish stereotypes. Not all people with big money are right wing radicals. There are people center or center left with plenty of money. There are people who are right of center who believe in democracy . There are others who know Trump is bad for business . I know many very wealthy people who lean right, typically vote R and hate Trump.
None of these are the mega-wealthy right wingers who have been orchestrating the Republican attack on the country for the last forty years -- and none of them have any real influence on events (it is unclear why Barr was included in this list -- he is no better than Trump, and at this point not trusted by anyone, R or D). The mega-wealthy lined up on the fascist side (Crow, Adelson, Koch, etc) far outweigh the number of mega-wealthy people working to preserve the U.S. under the Constitution. Also note: The attacks on the U.S. government by these mega-wealthy right wingers constitute a series of battles -- the U.S. constitutional government must win every one of these battles to prevent a fascist takeover -- the right wing only needs to win once ... which they eventually will.
You seem not to apprehend my suggestion but instead to be focused on the notion that there are some very rich people with very bad - indeed fascist - ideas. I will stipulate that point, although Adelson remains very dead. The point isn’t where the money to advance the campaign comes from. The point is the message needs to be advanced by people who have credibility with people center to right. There are lots of ways to fund the effort .
How about if the negative ads were “rapist. Fraud, tax cheat. Cop killing insurrection, anti-military, Putin communist, traitor, sore loser, cry baby, golf cheater, .....” not about policy blah blah
I think the donor class is trying to find the consensus candidate that they support if Trump is found guilty and sentenced. He could well be the nominee due to primary wins, but if he is found guilty and sentenced....they have to put somebody in. But who will the diehards stomach. I think they run deSantis, I just can't see the party running a woman for President.
It doesn't matter if Trump is convicted of crimes -- doesn't stop him from running, and will only make him more popular among his supporters ... and evidently the majority of the country doesn't care if he's a convicted criminal.
Trump is everything that Republicans value most in a politician:
(1) A blatant, habitual liar.!!! (Absolutely imperative for any Republican politician.)
(2) Totally corrupt (sticks it to the libs who value honesty and integrity).
(3) Massively ignorant (gives them something they can identify with).
(4) Incredibly stupid (again, something they can identify with and, again, sticks it to the libs who value intelligence).
(5) Narcissistic -- someone who revels in mass rape, mass torture, and mass murder -- which his supporters cheer enthusiastically at every rally.
(6) Hates the U.S. as a country of laws which would restrain his supporters actions of rape, torture, and murder of anyone they decide they dislike.
(7) Hatred of non-whites be they blacks, Hispanics, Native Americans, middle easterners, etc -- sits particularly well with the neo-Nazis, neo-Confederates, Christian Nationalists, etc that form the bulk of the Republican party.
(8) Hatred of non-Christians (and a large percentage of Christians) -- again, a core hatred of the vast majority of Republicans.
It is unclear how any other Republicans could distinguish him/herself from Trump on any of these issues.
The "Republican Establishment" are like the German conservatives who told President Hindenburg to appoint Hitler as Chancellor because they could "control him."
Chris - do the donors think of this as simply a math problem? Are they thinking if they can eliminate all republican candidates but one, and throw all of their support behind that one, with all of their firepower only aimed at Trump (forget policy, etc., just as Trump has done), they can then possibly beat Trump one-on-one? Further, if Trump still wins the nomination, at that point, they would have hurt Trump enough that he would not have a chance to pick up any independent and other swing voters, which would doom his candidacy in the General Election? Not sure what else they could be targeting?
One thing would become clearer - would not think either candidate (DeSantis or Haley) would show up for this meeting if they were still hoping for a VP slot? And frankly, you might not want whichever of the two candidates is not chosen then becoming the VP candidate either..., so one of the two candidates would have to agree to drop from the race - I am not sure I see either of them willing to do that at this early date, do you?
It’s baked in at this point. It’s much too late. The donor class and their consultants simply do not have a finger on the pulse of today’s party, and nothing they do now is going to matter much. The only other possible red line is if people abandon him if and when the fraud judgments bankrupt him and/or he’s convicted of actual felonies by a jury. Even at that, he’s likely to come up with BS reasons why even jury trials or judges are all unfair and rigged against him. The party faithful will continue to ignore Occam’s Razor.
Don't give too much credence to Republican donors claiming to not support Trump -- they have supported the development of the Republican party as a fascist party dedicated to the overthrow of the U.S. constitutional system and the imposition of a fascist dictatorship for the past sixty years. Trump is just the latest step in their project -- and a continuation of the plan.
My thoughts exactly. This is Trumps nomination to lose. It sickens me that this country is barreling towards a 2nd Trump nomination. Ironically, I just read that NBC is reporting that DeSantis and Haley are regarded to be second to Trump. Okay, on what universe will they overcome Trump? Something catastrophic has to happen or for a reason we do not see yet, the bottom drops out for Trump.
Regarding Trump's total identity with The Trump Organization and especially Trump Tower - would losing control of them, per the NY ruling this week, be enough to knock him for a loop? Enough so that he would dissolve into a gibbering, maniacal pool of slobber? Wow, what a lovely image that is.
There may not be any way to stop Trump, but there is an honorable and necessary way to try. It's time for the voices of sanity to speak in an organized way, rather than in the odd interview or off the record comments here or there. Mattis, Kelly, Millie, Cohen, Barr, Esper, Rosen, Romney, Flake, Cheney, Corker, etc, need to join forces and say what they've seen and know about Trump and the dangers he presents. They should join forces with the Lincoln Project or form their own group. There is plenty of money to support a loud and proud media campaign. It's possible such a broad and credentialed group could shake the non-MAGA crowd out of their slumber. We and they need to stop acting as if this is a normal campaign cycle. These folks speaking up may not work, but they owe it to the Country to try.
I have been hoping that the group you mention would come out also.
You are buying the idea that these mega-wealthy Republicans really want to stop Trump. Sorry to say it this way, but don't be naive -- they have supported the radicalization of the Republican party every step of the way for the last sixty years. The notion that they want to stop now that they are close to achieving their objective of establishing a fascist dictatorship here begs credulity.
No sir, I am buying the idea that the types of people I identified are sane and truly want to stop Trump. The money can be found from various corners left, right, and center. You call me naive; I say in response you are painting with a broad and imprecise brush , buying cartoonish stereotypes. Not all people with big money are right wing radicals. There are people center or center left with plenty of money. There are people who are right of center who believe in democracy . There are others who know Trump is bad for business . I know many very wealthy people who lean right, typically vote R and hate Trump.
"Mattis, Kelly, Millie, Cohen, Barr, Esper, Rosen, Romney, Flake, Cheney, Corker"
None of these are the mega-wealthy right wingers who have been orchestrating the Republican attack on the country for the last forty years -- and none of them have any real influence on events (it is unclear why Barr was included in this list -- he is no better than Trump, and at this point not trusted by anyone, R or D). The mega-wealthy lined up on the fascist side (Crow, Adelson, Koch, etc) far outweigh the number of mega-wealthy people working to preserve the U.S. under the Constitution. Also note: The attacks on the U.S. government by these mega-wealthy right wingers constitute a series of battles -- the U.S. constitutional government must win every one of these battles to prevent a fascist takeover -- the right wing only needs to win once ... which they eventually will.
You seem not to apprehend my suggestion but instead to be focused on the notion that there are some very rich people with very bad - indeed fascist - ideas. I will stipulate that point, although Adelson remains very dead. The point isn’t where the money to advance the campaign comes from. The point is the message needs to be advanced by people who have credibility with people center to right. There are lots of ways to fund the effort .
This is what https://www.operationsavingdemocracy.org/ is trying to do, starting from the military perspective...
General Miley , in his retirement speech this afternoon, rebuked Trump as a “wanna be dictator.”
I still can’t wrap my head around the fact that, after ALL the evidence to this, people still support him! It’s really scary!
How about if the negative ads were “rapist. Fraud, tax cheat. Cop killing insurrection, anti-military, Putin communist, traitor, sore loser, cry baby, golf cheater, .....” not about policy blah blah
You forgot FRAUDSTER as well DK Brooklyn
I think the donor class is trying to find the consensus candidate that they support if Trump is found guilty and sentenced. He could well be the nominee due to primary wins, but if he is found guilty and sentenced....they have to put somebody in. But who will the diehards stomach. I think they run deSantis, I just can't see the party running a woman for President.
It doesn't matter if Trump is convicted of crimes -- doesn't stop him from running, and will only make him more popular among his supporters ... and evidently the majority of the country doesn't care if he's a convicted criminal.
Trump is everything that Republicans value most in a politician:
(1) A blatant, habitual liar.!!! (Absolutely imperative for any Republican politician.)
(2) Totally corrupt (sticks it to the libs who value honesty and integrity).
(3) Massively ignorant (gives them something they can identify with).
(4) Incredibly stupid (again, something they can identify with and, again, sticks it to the libs who value intelligence).
(5) Narcissistic -- someone who revels in mass rape, mass torture, and mass murder -- which his supporters cheer enthusiastically at every rally.
(6) Hates the U.S. as a country of laws which would restrain his supporters actions of rape, torture, and murder of anyone they decide they dislike.
(7) Hatred of non-whites be they blacks, Hispanics, Native Americans, middle easterners, etc -- sits particularly well with the neo-Nazis, neo-Confederates, Christian Nationalists, etc that form the bulk of the Republican party.
(8) Hatred of non-Christians (and a large percentage of Christians) -- again, a core hatred of the vast majority of Republicans.
It is unclear how any other Republicans could distinguish him/herself from Trump on any of these issues.
Sure, but other than those things you've listed, what faults does the man have??
[Sarcasm font in *bold*]
As I said, for Republicans these are not bugs but features.
The "Republican Establishment" are like the German conservatives who told President Hindenburg to appoint Hitler as Chancellor because they could "control him."
IT. IS. A. CULT!!!!!!
Chris - do the donors think of this as simply a math problem? Are they thinking if they can eliminate all republican candidates but one, and throw all of their support behind that one, with all of their firepower only aimed at Trump (forget policy, etc., just as Trump has done), they can then possibly beat Trump one-on-one? Further, if Trump still wins the nomination, at that point, they would have hurt Trump enough that he would not have a chance to pick up any independent and other swing voters, which would doom his candidacy in the General Election? Not sure what else they could be targeting?
One thing would become clearer - would not think either candidate (DeSantis or Haley) would show up for this meeting if they were still hoping for a VP slot? And frankly, you might not want whichever of the two candidates is not chosen then becoming the VP candidate either..., so one of the two candidates would have to agree to drop from the race - I am not sure I see either of them willing to do that at this early date, do you?
It’s baked in at this point. It’s much too late. The donor class and their consultants simply do not have a finger on the pulse of today’s party, and nothing they do now is going to matter much. The only other possible red line is if people abandon him if and when the fraud judgments bankrupt him and/or he’s convicted of actual felonies by a jury. Even at that, he’s likely to come up with BS reasons why even jury trials or judges are all unfair and rigged against him. The party faithful will continue to ignore Occam’s Razor.
Don't give too much credence to Republican donors claiming to not support Trump -- they have supported the development of the Republican party as a fascist party dedicated to the overthrow of the U.S. constitutional system and the imposition of a fascist dictatorship for the past sixty years. Trump is just the latest step in their project -- and a continuation of the plan.
My thoughts exactly. This is Trumps nomination to lose. It sickens me that this country is barreling towards a 2nd Trump nomination. Ironically, I just read that NBC is reporting that DeSantis and Haley are regarded to be second to Trump. Okay, on what universe will they overcome Trump? Something catastrophic has to happen or for a reason we do not see yet, the bottom drops out for Trump.
It’s barreling toward a third Trump nomination.
Correct. I was thinking that his 2nd time was as an incumbent and the people didn’t nominate him. But I stand corrected.
The other angle you could attack Trump on is electability...except that everybody "knows" that he won last time.
Go Trump 🇺🇲 2024
Ugh. These donors need to face reality and stop throwing away their money. Instead, use that money to help Biden defeat Trump in the general.
Good Radiance that these wealthy donors have not drunk the dirty Trump coolAid.
Regarding Trump's total identity with The Trump Organization and especially Trump Tower - would losing control of them, per the NY ruling this week, be enough to knock him for a loop? Enough so that he would dissolve into a gibbering, maniacal pool of slobber? Wow, what a lovely image that is.
Ugg !
Trump looks so stupid dancing 🕺