I'm happy with today's ruling, but obviously this isn't over. If SCOTUS would eventually overturn it (and I doubt they will), wouldn't they be granting the same immunity protection to Biden? In that scenario, couldn't Biden then arrest Trump and have him thrown in prison as a threat to democracy....without any repercussions. How delicious would that be?
You are correct. Biden would be given authority to do whatever he pleases… unless he is impeached and convicted first. Any individual’s opinion of Bush’s actions would be rendered moot, but the same would go for Bill Clinton and Obama. Complete immunity. It truly is inconceivable.
The SCOTUS is highly unlikely to reverse the DC Cir on the immunity issue. They may not even take the case or may affirm per curiam. On the other hand, the Colorado ruling is likely to be overturned. There are many grounds on which they might so rule. The most damaging of which would be a ruling that Trump didn’t participate in an effort that qualifies as an insurrection.
I had heard some legal analysts (Andrew Weissmann, Neal Katyal, et al) opine that the 3-judge panel would take their time to craft their decision, making it as solid as possible so that any appeal would be likely be rejected. Hopefully, that is the case here, and the full appeals court and/or SCOTUS won't be able to find reason to agree with Trump's arguments.
It seems as if the counter-argument to tfg's claims that any president would be immediately prosecuted by the opposing party upon leaving office is that most Americans would consider the de facto dictatorship that such a ruling would provide is vastly the greater of two evils. Not to mention the fact that a party would doubtfully risk political backfire for prosecuting an outgoing president without evidence. I for one will sleep better tonight knowing that the apolitical rule of law still stands.
Jeff - I believe SCOTUS could agree to review the case, however, lift the stay during the pendency of their review. Usually, this might be a signal they wish to weigh in, however, not be likely to overturn the underlying judgement. I would expect Trump to request to appeal first to the full court of appeals “en banc”, and they, too, could decide to lift the stay during their review. Expect Jack Smith to request rather quickly a lifting of the stay, regardless of which court will hear the appeal.
I breathed a huge sigh of thanksgiving and cheering loudly. Democracy is off the vent. Still in ICU but at least can breathe in its own again. I've felt like we've been holding its hand since 2016 and tighter during proceeding years to 2021. Lots can happen still but HUGE win today! Thanks, Chris for breaking down great news!!! 🥳🥳🥳🥳🥳🥳
It's not quite time for "We are the Champions" but it's certainly a win that deserves major recognition and thanks to the panel of appeals court judges who provided the ruling.
Chris, a great day for democracy indeed. Although, it seems to still be a long slog through the appeals process, I will take this win. We need to fight hard this year, a lot is at stake. We need to take the wins as they come and hope that the end result will be a huge win in November.
Upgrade means to upgrade from regular subscriber rate to a "founding member rate" it's just what Substack has the button displays for those who are already subscribed instead of what it shows to free subscribers. Chris is asking people who are free subscribers who read regularly to consider a subscription if they can.
Ok. Thanks. My point in asking was, normally it says “subscribed,” but this time it said “upgrade,” nothing about founding member. I appreciate your help.
The Appeals Court’s decision is so thorough, I hope that the Supreme Court just denies the appeal. However, I fear that it won’t and that it will try to find some way to “slow walk” this matter past the next election.
I'm happy with today's ruling, but obviously this isn't over. If SCOTUS would eventually overturn it (and I doubt they will), wouldn't they be granting the same immunity protection to Biden? In that scenario, couldn't Biden then arrest Trump and have him thrown in prison as a threat to democracy....without any repercussions. How delicious would that be?
You are correct. Biden would be given authority to do whatever he pleases… unless he is impeached and convicted first. Any individual’s opinion of Bush’s actions would be rendered moot, but the same would go for Bill Clinton and Obama. Complete immunity. It truly is inconceivable.
The SCOTUS is highly unlikely to reverse the DC Cir on the immunity issue. They may not even take the case or may affirm per curiam. On the other hand, the Colorado ruling is likely to be overturned. There are many grounds on which they might so rule. The most damaging of which would be a ruling that Trump didn’t participate in an effort that qualifies as an insurrection.
I turned on FOX Noise to see their take on it. They don't seem to be reporting it.
Quelle surprise.
Probably huddling on how to spin it
Abominable!
I can't believe it took the court this long, and 57 pages, to decide what seemed to be a no-brainer to everyone who looked at it.
I had heard some legal analysts (Andrew Weissmann, Neal Katyal, et al) opine that the 3-judge panel would take their time to craft their decision, making it as solid as possible so that any appeal would be likely be rejected. Hopefully, that is the case here, and the full appeals court and/or SCOTUS won't be able to find reason to agree with Trump's arguments.
WS Gilbert 1887 "Ruddigore"
For duty, duty must be done;
The rule applies to every one,
And painful though that duty be,
To shirk the task were fiddle-de-dee
Good day tday for Democracy and even better days are coming in 2025 WHEN Joe Biden is again inaugurated as the next President
This is the best news I've heard in a long time!
It seems as if the counter-argument to tfg's claims that any president would be immediately prosecuted by the opposing party upon leaving office is that most Americans would consider the de facto dictatorship that such a ruling would provide is vastly the greater of two evils. Not to mention the fact that a party would doubtfully risk political backfire for prosecuting an outgoing president without evidence. I for one will sleep better tonight knowing that the apolitical rule of law still stands.
This decision is good news, but...it only matters if SCOTUS either declines to hear the case or hears it and issues a very quick ruling.
Short of that, Trump gets what he wants...a delay of judgment until after the election,... and that would be very unfortunate for our democracy.
Jeff - I believe SCOTUS could agree to review the case, however, lift the stay during the pendency of their review. Usually, this might be a signal they wish to weigh in, however, not be likely to overturn the underlying judgement. I would expect Trump to request to appeal first to the full court of appeals “en banc”, and they, too, could decide to lift the stay during their review. Expect Jack Smith to request rather quickly a lifting of the stay, regardless of which court will hear the appeal.
I breathed a huge sigh of thanksgiving and cheering loudly. Democracy is off the vent. Still in ICU but at least can breathe in its own again. I've felt like we've been holding its hand since 2016 and tighter during proceeding years to 2021. Lots can happen still but HUGE win today! Thanks, Chris for breaking down great news!!! 🥳🥳🥳🥳🥳🥳
It's not quite time for "We are the Champions" but it's certainly a win that deserves major recognition and thanks to the panel of appeals court judges who provided the ruling.
Chris, a great day for democracy indeed. Although, it seems to still be a long slog through the appeals process, I will take this win. We need to fight hard this year, a lot is at stake. We need to take the wins as they come and hope that the end result will be a huge win in November.
What are the chances that SCOTUS will uphold Democracy?
First, I am a paid subscriber and being asked to upgrade. Maybe it’s a glitch.
In any event, seems like this ruling took longer than it should have. But better late than never.
Upgrade means to upgrade from regular subscriber rate to a "founding member rate" it's just what Substack has the button displays for those who are already subscribed instead of what it shows to free subscribers. Chris is asking people who are free subscribers who read regularly to consider a subscription if they can.
Ok. Thanks. My point in asking was, normally it says “subscribed,” but this time it said “upgrade,” nothing about founding member. I appreciate your help.
We're just "included," not required. Chris wants everyone to do what we did. Don't overthink things.
!!!!!
Needed a day like today.
The Appeals Court’s decision is so thorough, I hope that the Supreme Court just denies the appeal. However, I fear that it won’t and that it will try to find some way to “slow walk” this matter past the next election.