"Roll the tape," as they say ... how many times has Trump called Biden, Harris and anyone who doesn't fawn over him, fascists, communists, Marxists (define those, Donny, I dare ya) and a threat to democracy? So, he gets to do it?
Yes, of course he does. He is not held accountable for anything he does, and everyone else who does the same stuff. That's just Trump's universe, and it seems that the GOP and all the bootlickers and hangers-on operate in that space.
Stand firm! There are no excuses for the people that make haste to be included in the power circle, and sell out for the privilege. Don’t change, and you’ll be remembered and appreciated.
Doing a reset for them makes some sense. Not sure it's a sellout move or whether the network execs pushed them into it. Either way, we all know Trump is transactional. I'm sure he welcomes the reset on his end -- he wants (good) coverage. But as soon as they call him out on the inevitable fascist parallels to come in 2025 and beyond, they'll go right back to being "the enemy of the people" in Trump's eyes.
In other words, I'm not really sure what this does -- unless they truly do sell out and not call out Trump on his fascism going forward.
To your point - calling people Hitler is silly and you lose credibility when you do so. You can say Trump is a bad guy or not your preferred candidate but when everything is an existential threat, nothing is.
Comparing Trump to Hitler when there are clearly parallels to between the two is important. It makes folks uncomfortable because it helps us to remember the consequences of a Europe under Hitler’s control. The hope then is that pushback on Trump will modify his behavior. And provides a warning to us all if he doesn’t. History is a great teacher. There is much data to process these days getting folks attention is clearly important. Many Americans after the election apparently googled “ is Biden still President”. Which shows how much attention people actually pay to election campaigns.
Why are people uncomfortable about comparing trump to Hitler? There are so many documentary’s, books and movies about him that the comparisons are truly legitimate. They both played on people’s emotions to hate a minority. Both of them preached hate and retribution. One used the military against its own citizens and the other is threatening to do the same. Both of them surrounded themselves with sycophants that were intellectually unqualified for their government jobs but were willing to do whatever they were asked to do. Absolutely trump parallels what Hitler was all about and America needs to wake up and realize that, that is a fact!
I think I will listen to Timothy Snyder! Trump is a. Existential threat and it pisses me off that any MSM person is sucking ass! lol maybe they need ratings since a lot of their normal Viewing audience is in a media black out !
Wow! I take this so differently. I am no Joe and Mika fan. I don’t watch them. But their quotes don’t suggest bending the knee to me. It suggests they have understood that Trump cares deeply about TV and not one bit about government/democracy and norms. It sounded to me like they wanted to open up communication in order to possibly influence Trump where he may not understand how bad the things his advisors are pushing will make him look with the American people. He is a populist and they want to help shape how he serves that. Democratic politicians currently have ZERO means to push back against Trump. We can all see this right now. Having a media force come in and try to fill that vacuum is good news to my mind.
They’ll only save themselves if they agree with his bad deeds. I doubt they will. I think they went there to increase their audience hoping his followers will watch them and learn the truth. They’re doing the right thing - he won, we accept - so when they start attacking him it will be more effective. They tried.
We’ve never dealt with anything like this before. I think they did it to gain leverage over him. If they stopped describing his acts as Hitler acts but then they were such Hitler acts they resumed saying it, it will make them more believable. It seems worth a try. Nothing else is working.
The Supreme Court ruled that tRump has *absolute immunity* for “official acts.”The convicted felon can call everything he says and does “official acts,” and be immune from prosecution for his unconstitutional actions.
He has already threatened to sic the DOJ on his enemies.
I think that this is the nail waiting for the hammer to hit it. I imagine the NBC powers that be strong-armed them to some extent. They were my favorite I am not watching now, and don’t know if I will. Podcasts are becoming attractive. I find it ironic that the media organizations that veered farther and farther right when their viewers embraced conspiracy theories on YouTube and TicToc and AM radio have driven the Left to those same venues with different hosts. With the same results ultimately? True radicals? In the meantime, I’m listening to BBCNews right now and reading @Ruminations here. I’m grieving. We will heal though. Then? We will all have to survive. We may discover we have to find ways to do that besides fighting and spitting. We may have to cut each other slack and even lie to protect each other. There may never be another election. Resistance is the word.
Absolute immunity for core constitutional duties (enumerated in Art II); only "presumptive immunity" for other official acts. This is an important distinction. Presumptions can be overcome.
The U.S. v Trump's rule of presumption of immunity, taken from Fitzgerald, has not yet been tested in court. "At a minimum, the President must be immune from prosecution for an official act unless the Government can show that applying a criminal prohibition to that act would pose no “dangers of intrusion on the authority and functions of the Executive Branch.” Fitzgerald, 457 U. S., at 754. "
Just another incident that calls into question the integrity of the media. Where is the truth? (Or does it exist anymore in an alternative facts universe?) Another day when I miss Walter Cronkite!
I used to enjoy watching Morning Joe, but I can't watch it anymore. Scarborough has become so arrogant in his delivery, and then when proven wrong doesn't admit his errors.
I like most things about M J, except Joe and Mika. I agree with your assessment of Joe, and Mika has done nothing but get more like him. Beyond that, I intensely dislike how dismissive he is of her, constantly interrupting and overriding her. Gotta wonder what's it's like at home.
I don't agree. Nothing could be more valuable than to hear the enemy's beliefs from his/her own mouth. Particularly if they are lies or distortions of the truth meant to disarm you. Nothing more effective than to catch a lie in action
This makes me so mad, especially with Mika. She knows better--and I say that as a fellow Child of the State Department. Her father's work for this country was in direct contrast to ppl like Trump and the folks in his circus.
Furthermore, her *brother* is the current U.S. Ambassador to Poland. Let that bit sink in.
Give that bit ^^ another second... it's ok, I'll wait.
Now, my hope is that this is a sincere endeavor and driven by instincts that come from her being in a family full of diplomats and folks whose job it is (or was) to extend a branch to an adversary. But, in the aftermath of shennanigans like Bezos with WaPo my hope is, at best, dimly lit.
Chris, I appreciate your commentary and I understand that Mika and Joe seek access. However, I think that the way they went about it is nothing more than bending the knee to Trump. That is how Trump sees it and that is how he will promote it. Trump has talked frequently about taking away the licenses of media that is critical of him and I think it is appropriate to call that fascist behavior. It certainly is not democratic behavior, which would have profound respect for the First Amendment protections afforded to the press. Trump has spent years calling for his enemies to be prosecuted and has even tried to get the DOJ to do so. He regularly calls democrats communists, marxists and fascists, though he doesn’t know what those words mean. He considers the press his enemy, along with his opposition such as Hillary Clinton and Joe Biden. I was extremely disappointed in Mika and Joe. We are about to enter a very threatening time for US democracy and I think that normalizing the behavior of someone just because they won the election is not appropriate.
I watch Morning Joe every day. I saw it this morning. I enjoy the show, except that sports is talked about too much. They have mentioned in the past knowing Trump when he was a Democrat. But it was surprising to hear them say they visited Trump over the weekend.
I have mixed feelings about it. I assume they were invited to the residence, which in a way is good. I don't get the impression they are now bending the knee to Trump and will buy his Bible and all that.
I assume the show will go on as before; they will criticize Trump and the administration for issues they oppose, and praise him for any accomplishments he may have. If he ends NATO, he will be criticized. If he ends the ACA, likewise. I seriously doubt they will make excuses now for him, simply because they visited his shrine.
But if it should happen that the show turns into Morning MAGA, then I will change the channel or sleep late on weekdays. Let's wait and see.
I think this sort of rhetoric is partially to blame for why our politics have become so divided and toxic. Both sides do it and it sucks.
In my adult life I have seen Reagan, Bush Sr, GW Bush and Trump all called Hitler. (Probably Romney and McCain as well but I don’t specifically recall it). The reality is none of them were Hitler as it is hard for anybody to be as evil as a man who systematically exterminated 6 million people due to their religion.
So what happens when it becomes obvious they are not Hitler? After a while there becomes a Chicken Little problem. When the sky doesn’t fall, what do you tell people? Will they believe you when the sky is truly falling? The apocalyptic rhetoric has begun to fall upon deaf ears.
President Trump is problematic. There are myriad reasons to oppose him and his policies. Even more reason to loath his personality. But Hitler comparisons go too far in my opinion and do little other than to diminish the person making the comparison.
Wow, woke up to that news this morning. I did not expect morning Joe to “obey in advance” & capitulate so quickly. Definitely a groveling,CYA tour of Mira Lago to protect themselves from retribution from the big orange man baby. Well we are witnessing the pillars of democracy, a free press beginning to fall. So much for journalistic integrity and freedom of the press.
"Roll the tape," as they say ... how many times has Trump called Biden, Harris and anyone who doesn't fawn over him, fascists, communists, Marxists (define those, Donny, I dare ya) and a threat to democracy? So, he gets to do it?
Yes, of course he does. He is not held accountable for anything he does, and everyone else who does the same stuff. That's just Trump's universe, and it seems that the GOP and all the bootlickers and hangers-on operate in that space.
Stand firm! There are no excuses for the people that make haste to be included in the power circle, and sell out for the privilege. Don’t change, and you’ll be remembered and appreciated.
Doing a reset for them makes some sense. Not sure it's a sellout move or whether the network execs pushed them into it. Either way, we all know Trump is transactional. I'm sure he welcomes the reset on his end -- he wants (good) coverage. But as soon as they call him out on the inevitable fascist parallels to come in 2025 and beyond, they'll go right back to being "the enemy of the people" in Trump's eyes.
In other words, I'm not really sure what this does -- unless they truly do sell out and not call out Trump on his fascism going forward.
I’m wondering if I should turn off Savannah and Hoda? Dang NBC.
To your point - calling people Hitler is silly and you lose credibility when you do so. You can say Trump is a bad guy or not your preferred candidate but when everything is an existential threat, nothing is.
Correct
Comparing Trump to Hitler when there are clearly parallels to between the two is important. It makes folks uncomfortable because it helps us to remember the consequences of a Europe under Hitler’s control. The hope then is that pushback on Trump will modify his behavior. And provides a warning to us all if he doesn’t. History is a great teacher. There is much data to process these days getting folks attention is clearly important. Many Americans after the election apparently googled “ is Biden still President”. Which shows how much attention people actually pay to election campaigns.
Why are people uncomfortable about comparing trump to Hitler? There are so many documentary’s, books and movies about him that the comparisons are truly legitimate. They both played on people’s emotions to hate a minority. Both of them preached hate and retribution. One used the military against its own citizens and the other is threatening to do the same. Both of them surrounded themselves with sycophants that were intellectually unqualified for their government jobs but were willing to do whatever they were asked to do. Absolutely trump parallels what Hitler was all about and America needs to wake up and realize that, that is a fact!
I think I will listen to Timothy Snyder! Trump is a. Existential threat and it pisses me off that any MSM person is sucking ass! lol maybe they need ratings since a lot of their normal Viewing audience is in a media black out !
Wow! I take this so differently. I am no Joe and Mika fan. I don’t watch them. But their quotes don’t suggest bending the knee to me. It suggests they have understood that Trump cares deeply about TV and not one bit about government/democracy and norms. It sounded to me like they wanted to open up communication in order to possibly influence Trump where he may not understand how bad the things his advisors are pushing will make him look with the American people. He is a populist and they want to help shape how he serves that. Democratic politicians currently have ZERO means to push back against Trump. We can all see this right now. Having a media force come in and try to fill that vacuum is good news to my mind.
That’s their spin to make them not look cowardly. I strongly suspect the real reason is to save themselves from being arrested.
We lost an election. We haven't lost the 1st Amendment. Please calm down.
They’ll only save themselves if they agree with his bad deeds. I doubt they will. I think they went there to increase their audience hoping his followers will watch them and learn the truth. They’re doing the right thing - he won, we accept - so when they start attacking him it will be more effective. They tried.
We’ve never dealt with anything like this before. I think they did it to gain leverage over him. If they stopped describing his acts as Hitler acts but then they were such Hitler acts they resumed saying it, it will make them more believable. It seems worth a try. Nothing else is working.
That’s a horrifying thought. And I can’t deny it could easily be their true motivation. We are in a horrible place.
The Supreme Court ruled that tRump has *absolute immunity* for “official acts.”The convicted felon can call everything he says and does “official acts,” and be immune from prosecution for his unconstitutional actions.
He has already threatened to sic the DOJ on his enemies.
I think that this is the nail waiting for the hammer to hit it. I imagine the NBC powers that be strong-armed them to some extent. They were my favorite I am not watching now, and don’t know if I will. Podcasts are becoming attractive. I find it ironic that the media organizations that veered farther and farther right when their viewers embraced conspiracy theories on YouTube and TicToc and AM radio have driven the Left to those same venues with different hosts. With the same results ultimately? True radicals? In the meantime, I’m listening to BBCNews right now and reading @Ruminations here. I’m grieving. We will heal though. Then? We will all have to survive. We may discover we have to find ways to do that besides fighting and spitting. We may have to cut each other slack and even lie to protect each other. There may never be another election. Resistance is the word.
Yes, we are all in this together. I pray for truth and justice to prevail.🕊️
Absolute immunity for core constitutional duties (enumerated in Art II); only "presumptive immunity" for other official acts. This is an important distinction. Presumptions can be overcome.
Yes, that’s good, but if an issue went to the Supreme Court, they would almost certainly rule in his favor.
The U.S. v Trump's rule of presumption of immunity, taken from Fitzgerald, has not yet been tested in court. "At a minimum, the President must be immune from prosecution for an official act unless the Government can show that applying a criminal prohibition to that act would pose no “dangers of intrusion on the authority and functions of the Executive Branch.” Fitzgerald, 457 U. S., at 754. "
Thanks for the information.
Just another incident that calls into question the integrity of the media. Where is the truth? (Or does it exist anymore in an alternative facts universe?) Another day when I miss Walter Cronkite!
Amen!
I used to enjoy watching Morning Joe, but I can't watch it anymore. Scarborough has become so arrogant in his delivery, and then when proven wrong doesn't admit his errors.
I like most things about M J, except Joe and Mika. I agree with your assessment of Joe, and Mika has done nothing but get more like him. Beyond that, I intensely dislike how dismissive he is of her, constantly interrupting and overriding her. Gotta wonder what's it's like at home.
When will people learn that Trump can’t be influenced by folks like Mika and Joe. He simply uses them if he can. A silly waste of time.
I don't agree. Nothing could be more valuable than to hear the enemy's beliefs from his/her own mouth. Particularly if they are lies or distortions of the truth meant to disarm you. Nothing more effective than to catch a lie in action
Absolutely! And to have some input.
Well said Chris, but that is the problem when journalists take sides.
Completely baffling to me. I’m still digesting the loss of the election.
This makes me so mad, especially with Mika. She knows better--and I say that as a fellow Child of the State Department. Her father's work for this country was in direct contrast to ppl like Trump and the folks in his circus.
Furthermore, her *brother* is the current U.S. Ambassador to Poland. Let that bit sink in.
Give that bit ^^ another second... it's ok, I'll wait.
Now, my hope is that this is a sincere endeavor and driven by instincts that come from her being in a family full of diplomats and folks whose job it is (or was) to extend a branch to an adversary. But, in the aftermath of shennanigans like Bezos with WaPo my hope is, at best, dimly lit.
Chris, I appreciate your commentary and I understand that Mika and Joe seek access. However, I think that the way they went about it is nothing more than bending the knee to Trump. That is how Trump sees it and that is how he will promote it. Trump has talked frequently about taking away the licenses of media that is critical of him and I think it is appropriate to call that fascist behavior. It certainly is not democratic behavior, which would have profound respect for the First Amendment protections afforded to the press. Trump has spent years calling for his enemies to be prosecuted and has even tried to get the DOJ to do so. He regularly calls democrats communists, marxists and fascists, though he doesn’t know what those words mean. He considers the press his enemy, along with his opposition such as Hillary Clinton and Joe Biden. I was extremely disappointed in Mika and Joe. We are about to enter a very threatening time for US democracy and I think that normalizing the behavior of someone just because they won the election is not appropriate.
I watch Morning Joe every day. I saw it this morning. I enjoy the show, except that sports is talked about too much. They have mentioned in the past knowing Trump when he was a Democrat. But it was surprising to hear them say they visited Trump over the weekend.
I have mixed feelings about it. I assume they were invited to the residence, which in a way is good. I don't get the impression they are now bending the knee to Trump and will buy his Bible and all that.
I assume the show will go on as before; they will criticize Trump and the administration for issues they oppose, and praise him for any accomplishments he may have. If he ends NATO, he will be criticized. If he ends the ACA, likewise. I seriously doubt they will make excuses now for him, simply because they visited his shrine.
But if it should happen that the show turns into Morning MAGA, then I will change the channel or sleep late on weekdays. Let's wait and see.
I think this sort of rhetoric is partially to blame for why our politics have become so divided and toxic. Both sides do it and it sucks.
In my adult life I have seen Reagan, Bush Sr, GW Bush and Trump all called Hitler. (Probably Romney and McCain as well but I don’t specifically recall it). The reality is none of them were Hitler as it is hard for anybody to be as evil as a man who systematically exterminated 6 million people due to their religion.
So what happens when it becomes obvious they are not Hitler? After a while there becomes a Chicken Little problem. When the sky doesn’t fall, what do you tell people? Will they believe you when the sky is truly falling? The apocalyptic rhetoric has begun to fall upon deaf ears.
President Trump is problematic. There are myriad reasons to oppose him and his policies. Even more reason to loath his personality. But Hitler comparisons go too far in my opinion and do little other than to diminish the person making the comparison.
Wow, woke up to that news this morning. I did not expect morning Joe to “obey in advance” & capitulate so quickly. Definitely a groveling,CYA tour of Mira Lago to protect themselves from retribution from the big orange man baby. Well we are witnessing the pillars of democracy, a free press beginning to fall. So much for journalistic integrity and freedom of the press.